Engine bay cleanup and front mount

[milgo]

Right hello there.

Just thought i would make a post up about the work i have started doing on my phase 1 21 turbo. Unfortunatly i'm a little limited on time. I have 1 week to do the majority of the work and maybe up to 2 weeks to finish which isnt long for me as i like to take my time. But i'm going to do my best.

The engine has recently been rebuilt by the previously owner about a year ago and has covered roughly 7000 miles since. Also a new turbo 3000 ago. So i can leave that alone. But he didnt really tart anything up so i plan just to give it a bit of a lift and sort out some of the bodges it has recieved over the years.

All the front end on the car is a bit rough. The bumper has been cut up, the nose cone messed about with as well as the cross member and grill. At some stage someone fitted a cosworth intercooler which seems to be the cause for all this mess.

Here is a nice example, the rad fans have been screwed into a plastic conduit which is then screwed into a piece of folded sheet which rests over the rad, class!

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00342.jpg

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00331.jpg

To fix properly it will need all new bits on the front along with a set of headlights which have also been cut about a bit. But to start with i will begin to clean up the engine bay.

Over the weekend, mostly today i have removed pretty much all of the parts. The exhaust manifold has a crack which needs welding, the intake manifold needs bead blasting and i'm going to fit a 3 bar fuel pressure regualtor somewhere. The injectors need to be sent off to be cleaned and all the brackets taken etc to be zinc coated and some of the other bits powder coated.

Here is the engine bay on friday:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00340.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00341.jpg
Here it is today:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00345.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00343.jpg
Here are the hoses i have so far for the forge front mount i have ordered:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00339.jpg
Here is a 63 to 60 reducing joiner i made up specially:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00338.jpg

I plan to make the majority of the joiners up myself if i get the chance. I am also going to fit a cone filter and mount it down in the gap for the wing mounted intercooler.

[milgo]

Made up my enlarged induction inlet today. Goes from the std size of 60mm on the turbo inlet to 80mm so i can get a bigger hose and bigger cone on the end.

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00354.jpg

Going to go for a jetex cone filter rated at 410bhp 172mm long with 175mm OD.

[DaveL485]

That boost reducer is smart, im assuming you made it?

:love:

[milgo]

Thanks dave, yeah all the metal and plastic bits i put up will have been made by me unless i say otherwise. I have to make most of them as i am going from a 51mm outlet to a 63.5mm intercooler and then back to a 57mm plenum again.

I got my "charge hose" samco xtreme hose through yesterday and noticed the plenum is 57mm not 60. Thats why you should measure the part its fitting to and not some nackered rubber pipe! I ordered another 57mm jobby along with some T pieces etc. And then turned down my joiner again to suit, so 63 to 57 and the nput a bit of a chamfer on it to help the air flow a little bit better.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00359-1.jpg
Here it is on the turbo inlet with the T piece which is bringing in the crank case fumes. I might think about putting ina catch tank but for now this is the easiest way.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00362.jpg

Next job the heatshield bracket which was a bit rusty and had a snapped stud.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00351-1.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00352-1.jpg
Got some fellow apprentices to grind them out for me as i am on the machines at the moment. I turned down some socket screws to give them flat shoulders and then put them in position. I also gave it a little cleanup.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00360-1.jpg
Got one of the welders to tack on the backs. Gave it a thorough going over in the shot blaster and it came out like so:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00366.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00365.jpg
Also cleaned up an array of other brackets from the head and remote oil filter.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00364.jpg
There was a small rubber mounting for the oil housing which was past its best so i made up a nylon sleeve to replace the rubber.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00368.jpg

Oh an looky what also turned up today, yipee:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00367.jpg

[Lee_R21Turbo]

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00362.jpg

Without meaning to piss on ya chips so to speak mate.....

I'd defo vent the crankcase fumes back to a catch can rather than back into the intake.....and also I see you dont run a top slam panel on the car - I'd recommend you find one to fit - but then by doing that that hose going onto the turbo will no longer fit.

I wish I had access to machining tools like that....very impressive mate!!!! :good: :good:

[milgo]

I have a slam panel mate all be it a bit cut up. Just removed to get access to all the bits and make some space. The hose is only 70 odd mm long so it still fits in.

Why would you strongly recommend i vent the gases to a catch tank? I know it lowers the octane a little bit with it going to the intake but is there any other reason?

[Dave]

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00367.jpg

Hmmm, something worth checking..

Can you measure the ID of the boost hose inlet/outlets, and the width and depth of the fins of the intercooler.

[milgo]

Yeah il do that for you tomorrow dave. What you want the dimensions for can i ask?

[Lee_R21Turbo]

I have a slam panel mate all be it a bit cut up. Just removed to get access to all the bits and make some space. The hose is only 70 odd mm long so it still fits in.

Why would you strongly recommend i vent the gases to a catch tank? I know it lowers the octane a little bit with it going to the intake but is there any other reason?

Ok mate....but where is the filter fitting???

Well it obviously depends how much your engine is breathing but oil vapours in the intake are never really desirable, yes if theres to much it can aid det....plus the oil will get into your boost pipes, new intercooler etc!!!

[milgo]

I have ordered a 80mm 1m length of cold air feed pipe to route the filter down to the wheel arch. Now you mention it, it could be a bit tight but it will fit. If need be i can trim the coupling back anyway.

Does it affect intercooler efficiency or anything like that? I do hear what your saying though. I used to have a g40 and fitted a coke bottle to that as a temp measure. Always had problems with there being too much pressure though.

[Lee_R21Turbo]

Too much pressure is usually down to worn piston rings.......

Obviously if you've got an intercooler full of oil it aint going to help much is it! LOL!

Still a little unclear as to how you're going to pipe the air filter!

[Dave]

Yeah il do that for you tomorrow dave. What you want the dimensions for can i ask?

Looking at it, it seems like the total area of the fins is less or equal to the area of the inlet /outlets, and thats not taking into account the length of the core.....

Much like the top mount OEM intercooler on the 21, which is a restriction as internal area is reduced.

[milgo]

Right i think i see what you mean.

So The fins (bits that the air passes through) are 8mm tall and 60mm deep. And there are 7 of them.

The inner diameter is 60mm.

So the area of the inlet/outlet is 2826mm squared

8 x 60 x 7 gives 3360mm squared

But then if you take account for a 1mm (maybe less?) wall thickness it makes it 2436mm squared. So yeah thats a restriction like you say.

Does that mean you better off using smaller inlets and keeping the overall volume of air lower? I just assumed bigger is better when it comes to packing air through.

It might not be ideal, but for my application, not going for big power and after a cheapish improvement over the crappy cossie one it had in there before i think its ok. You could go into loads of detail but in reality i doubt id notice the difference if i had a tiny bit more intercooler capacity. A set of pace intercoolers are like £480 plus another £280 for samcos. Mine was only £230 plus hoses.

[Dave]

Its not going to be a problem for your application, but just to make evident to people that the pressure drop figures these manufacturers quote are bull, and how not all intercoolers are better than original designs.

You have measured that the area is smaller, but thats just if it was a step. Seeing as the restriction is now also say 600mm long (the width of the core for example), the restriction is furthe increased.

Much like when people upgrade to a larger throttle body.., if the rest of the boost hose diameter system is smaller, or the intercooler system you fit (like the one above) has a smaller diameter flow internals, then its all pretty pointless.

If you intercooler was a bit deeper, ie had a few more fins then it isnt a problem. You may find your Cossie one, has more flow...

[milgo]

Measured up the cossie one and annoyingly it has better flow as you say. Its got 3420 mm squared.

But it all swings in roudabouts. The new one has a much larger frontal area and is located where there is more airflow and not sitting above the radiator. The cooling fins are also larger so i would imagine it would cool much better.

[la21t]

I have that one fitted, and I noticed an instant improvement over anything else Ive ever tried.
Ive been thru standard ones, a Cossie one, the alloy Pace ones, an Iveco front mount and then this one from Forge. Ive been part of 4 fitments of this intercooler to the 21, and each person has commented on the difference they've noticed.

Keep going man, I wished I had ur talents.

[milgo]

cheers la21t thats great to know! Did you move your radiator back at all? I was considering tilting the top back to get some more clearance as the outlets are right under the headlight grill fixings.

[la21t]

No mate, Ive made no adjustments anywhere, on any of the 4 cars. Ive got some fitting photos somewhere, give me an email address and I'll send em to ya, as you cant post any pic on here bigger than an avatar lol

Cossie question mark hose off the turbo, into a 90 over the rad, straight into the cooler, repeat the same for the other side except the question mark hose. Mine fit behind the headlamp fittings, with a 16" Pacet fan sat between them :waah:

[milgo]

My email is daniel.milner2@ukonline.co.uk,if you could send me some piccies that would be wizard. How exactly did you mount yours? I have an idea how im going to do mine.

Hose wise i have bought them already. Got a questionmark hose made froma 135 and 45 degree universal ones.

[milgo]

Havnt updated for a little bit so thought id better.

I made up the two hose joiners for the boost control line and crank case fumes.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00372.jpg
I did some more shot blasting. All the Breather pipes, battery tray and ecu backing plate.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00371.jpg
Cleaned up the throttle body using degreaser and a toothbrush. The inside was very oily and gunked up.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00375.jpg

Got aquainted with the bead blaster this week. For those who dont know it uses glass beads rather than coarse sand shot.
Before: (I cleaned the inside of the rocker cover already with loads of degreaser!)
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00388.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00385.jpg
After:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00392.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00393.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00381.jpg
The results were good despite my group leader locking me in the room and spraying water in over the walls!

[Jo]

i dont wanna be an arse butt i dont like the idea using paint on the "inside" on the rocker cover. What if the paint come off ? Its getting hot in there...

Looks great btw !

[milgo]

it isn't paint jo. Just cleaned up using a gun which fires tiny bits of glass at the metal. I wouldnt like the idea of paint on the inside either :)

All the parts are just plain un-treated aluminium.

[Jo]

in that case: looks awesome !

[shep]

milgo,it all looks great cant wait to see the finished product :)

[am21T]

it isn't paint jo. Just cleaned up using a gun which fires tiny bits of glass at the metal. I wouldnt like the idea of paint on the inside either :)

All the parts are just plain un-treated aluminium.

Looks great,
i used a paint with crinkle finish on my covers and does give it a nice effect,but sure yours will look just as good,:good2: :good2:once done,

[DaveL485]

Looks fantastic mate. I'd suggest coating those shiny bits though, dirt and grime will stick to that untreated metal like **** to a blanket!

I'd suggest offering that bead blasting as a service to members if you can, earn a bit of pocket money! :dude:

[milgo]

Thanks for the possitive feedback everyone :) am21t is that crinkle finish like the stuff on old dashboards?

Right today i picked up my shot blasted parts from the metal platers and powder coating place. Wasn't expecting such a quick job.
Zinc coated bits:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00398.jpg
Close up:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00400.jpg
Powder coated bits:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00401.jpg
Close up:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00402.jpg

Also popped down to burton power and bought myself some 50mm hose joiners, as ive not got time to make anymore at work for now. Some waterproof connections for the slimline fans and a weber 3 bar fuel pressure regulator.
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00404.jpg

[DaveL485]

I'm sorry but you're taking the proverbial now :mrgreen:


**Throws hammerite back in the garage in disgust**

:clap:

[am21T]

the crinkle finish is a bit like the old dashboard finish but better,



its all looking good by the way,:good2: :good2: :good2:

[milgo]

Havn't posted for ages. Been busy faffing about getting more bits for the car and sorting it. Seems to be taking me forever but i'm almost there!

Here is the engine bay a few days ago, will pose up a new one tomorrow:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00410.jpg

Was busy today with alex sorting the intercooler. measured up for some intecooler bracket s and managed to get them laser cut at work. They came out really rough because the aluminium wasn't all that great. After some filing and rubbing down they came out alright.
Initially i had planned to glue to brackets on with some strong epoxy, but after research i decided to braze them on. Popped down to B and Q and bought a mapp brazing torch and some aluminium rods. Although its obviously easier than tig welding etc. its still hard seeing as you can't tell when the aluminium is about to melt. The results weren't pretty but it is nice and strong. After some practice i will get much better. For comparrison JB weld has a tensile strength of 4000psi where as brazing has something like 65000psi so you can see why i chose it over the glue.

Here is the intercooler with the brackets:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00416.jpg

Mounted it up on to the car through standard holes in the front so no drilling needed here. Spaced out roughly 15mm to clear the fans.

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00417.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00418.jpg

[Lee_R21Turbo]

Mate....fair play that looks a very neat awesome job......couple of points if you dont mind me commenting....

I take it you've got a joiner on the inlet side joining the two samcos together?

.....and I know from experience that unless you've adjusted the radiator the samcos going behind the headlights are going to be squashed???

But keep it coming mate - very impressive!!! Cant beat powdercoating!!!

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

[milgo]

Hey lee,
Yeah there is a joiner. Before i started i wasn't too sure what i was doing and i assumed bigger was better for intercooler outlet/inlet sizes so that is a 63 pipe which goes into my home made reducer to a 57. Thats why it looks so stepped.

I looked at moving the radiator back but its going to take me too long, need to try and get the car on the road today or tomorrow. One of the headlight brackets is broken anyway and the original nosecone has been hacked about as well. So the plan for now is to probably cut away the two mounts on the lights and trim a touch more from the bumper, which has also already been chewed up. Then i can start to improve it at a later date when i have more time. Get a new bumper etc.

[milgo]

Some more recent pictures of the engine bay:

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00429.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00430.jpg
Just got the induction kit resting in position for now:
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j136/milgo1/DSC00432.jpg
Been trying to get the front bumper on which is being a real pain. Looks like i will have to jiggle the intercooler up and backwards slightly to create a bit more clearance :/

[am21T]

Very Nice,:clap2: :clap2: :clap2:

[jonboy21t]

will look even nicer in my garage!!!!

[jonboy21t]

Sorry, looks even better in my garage - cheers Dan.....

We had a safe trip back yesterday - just got to get the 21 going....

Jonno

[jonboy21t]

Sorry, looks even better in my garage - cheers Dan.....

We had a safe trip back yesterday - just got to get the 21 going....

Jonno

awesome awesome awesome.......:splits: :splits: :splits:

[jonboy21t]

Front splitter now cut & fitted - looks good & secured safely, the car now looks complete...pics to follow when i've had time to take a few.